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Solo Ranked is not a place to get matts/gear


septru

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Dear globalled player that does not belong in solo ranked,

 

Please do not que solo ranked.

 

If you are getting repeatedly globaled, if multiple players are telling you to stop queing, if you do no dps or hps before you die, if you don't guard swap, if solo ranked feels overwhelming.... please do not que.

 

Solo ranked is not meant for you. You are bring the whole team down and you will only get vote kicked as a result.

 

Solo ranked is not a place to get gear. It is not a place to get matts. Regs is there for you. I luv regs and I'm sure you will too.

 

-A Caring Ranked Individual

Edited by septru
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I wrote it a few times already ever since they announced 5.10 and the gearing methods multiple 230-240 gear people started appearing in ranked. They do not talk at all, just get globalled and they keep on quing. Some do talk and say that they are getting UCs for gear mostly, none has said he is in for the mats (3 mats from solo ranked weekly only).

 

Its a hard topic. On one side people are happy if they are against such a player cause its an autowin, but on the other side people are angry if they get the player on their team and lose. Last night I lost 120 rating on one toon cause of such players, it was crazy. The problem is also the matchmaking which gives you a low rating person if your rating is high, so basically if you que with 1500 rating you have a 90% chance to get a person with 1100> rating in your team to carry him. This means that you need to only que when no such players are in que and last night these players qued till 1 am.

 

Overall this is killing ranked as it limits the time when you can que. If people see such players in que they stop quing, which is in the end, bad for everyone. On the other hand, they said on stream that even telling players "not to que" or "go do regs" is also harassment which should be reported. True, the player pays so he can do what he wants, but I really do not think letting such people to go into ranked is a good way to go.

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This is where the problem is. Those who go without any skill or without any plan to even try to win do NOT care.

 

Seems to be among the main problems of any kind of PVP in this game these days...

 

The question is how do you solve such a problem? You need to limit the possibility to que solo ranked in a way that only the people who (i don't know how to put it) "really mean it" get in. If you have a gear limit then quite a few people wont be able to que cause there will always be new players, people using not fully geared alts etc. Valor requirement is a way, but if people are bad, but have been around for a few years they will have maybe even valor 60-70 just from losing regs all this time. You cannot remove the rewards from PVP as the players need those too, they need UCs from the matches for gear and mats from weekly so that they have at least something to work with on the market.

 

So in the end, the only way I see is a combination of more things that would limit the players able to que ranked, but this will probably lead to pop decline in general.

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Concern is shared (hardly play solo ranked because of it) and just wanted to add abit of information.

 

I tested how much PvP was needed, half a year ago (without doing any Ranked), on a new Character. To get a full set of 248 and got past 6 days /played in Warzones only (Just above ½ the time, roughly, was spent in a Warzone due to que time and some afk). One of the weekends had a CXP event, that I played for like 12 hours. I got past Valor Rank 80 along the way.

 

For the more hardcore fans of PvP and grinders like myself, that is properly okay (feels good to slot in the last piece of gear in the end).

 

For someone playing 10 hours a week, that takes around 3 and a half month, but is reduced significantly by doing ranked and with weekly rewards. Have no idea how to solve it. Any suggestion I can imagine involve increasing que time and can easily be countered with the "low population issue" :).

 

I am glad someone brought it up and /good day

Edited by Mannok
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This is, unfortunately, another problem of low population that simply cannot be remedied. Even after you get the mat farmers out of the queue you'll still have the guy with barely 25 valor and absolutely no clue how to play his class possibly in the game with the best rated SR player in the server.

 

Even if you get all the mat farmers out, and make it harder for the val25noclue to join, you have an entire elo spectrum of skill fighting for one of the 8 or 16 spots available at any given queue pop(s).

 

The game will still likely get decided more-often by the lowest skilled participant rather than the combined efforts of everyone else.

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Dear globalled player that does not belong in solo ranked,

 

Please do not que solo ranked.

 

If you are getting repeatedly globaled, if multiple players are telling you to stop queing, if you do no dps or hps before you die, if you don't guard swap, if solo ranked feels overwhelming.... please do not que.

 

Solo ranked is not meant for you. You are bring the whole team down and you will only get vote kicked as a result.

 

Solo ranked is not a place to get gear. It is not a place to get matts. Regs is there for you. I luv regs and I'm sure you will too.

 

-A Caring Ranked Individual

 

You’ve been away too long. This is the “new” meta where Bioware want “everyone” who can click a mouse to play ranked. “Who cares about quality or other people’s ratings”. Just as long as their “queues” pop fast.

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All of this behavior, and many other bad behaviors, would be curtailed significantly if their account name was attached to their character name.

 

These guys getting insta ganked aren't their for that character, they're getting UC to buy stuff for their main. You're talking to a throw away toon. Attaching their account name to that characters name will at least enforce some measure of accountability.

 

(And obviously, if implemented, account wide ignores would also have to be in game.)

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Blame the idiot dev's for this. They decided a great way to increase a diminishing pvp population was to extort its player base into doing ranked instead of balancing classes. Reg's does not give the needed "mats" people are queuing for only ranked does and it's the 20 win one so your force people to que 20 times. So if it bothers you this much just boycott pvp altogether. Instead of calling the players "bads" and telling them they shouldn't que maybe you should tell this dev team they are "BAD" and should move on!
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Its a hard topic. On one side people are happy if they are against such a player cause its an autowin, but on the other side people are angry if they get the player on their team and lose.

 

Now in days, there are so many of them there is no way to predict it. Trust me, I've tried. It's a 50-50 chance. If you don't get them one round, you sure as hell will get them the next round.

 

Even after you get the mat farmers out of the queue you'll still have the guy with barely 25 valor and absolutely no clue how to play his class possibly in the game with the best rated SR player in the server.

This doesn't really piss me off that much tbh. I'm fine with the kid that gets globalled 5 times in a row but eventually learns. I'll probbaly still rage and be toxic but in the end I understand.

 

There's a big difference between people that learn though and people that play without a giving a single **** about winning.

 

This is, unfortunately, another problem of low population that simply cannot be remedied.

I honestly have no idea how to solve this issue. Low population, and matts have created a problem, but there is no definitive answer. On one hand, I enjoy earning matts in solo ranked and it also incentives a lot more people to play alts in ranked and keep the que alive rather then go play regs with friends. I don't think taking matts out of solo ranked is the solution.

 

Ultimately the only option left is to vote kick and "kindly ask" players to stop queing. Make it the least enjoyable process of farming matts/gear for the people that are making ranked the least enjoyable for everyone else.

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There's a big difference between people that learn though and people that play without a giving a single **** about winning.

 

That is not just related to ranked. It’s in all forums of pvp because Bioware just want numbers in the queue and not quality pvp.

People don’t care if they win or lose as long as they get what ever reward they are there for.

 

The only solution is for rewards to only drop from wins

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At this point they should just drop elo-rating for SR and run with a strict "winning gives X points"-system. I swear it would be more enjoyable for everyone.

That is actually a great idea. No need to punish people scores when so many factors are out of their control.

 

+1 for a win

 

Highest score per class gets a unique title

top 50 get a cool title or flair

200 wins get a mount

300 wins get a weapon box

 

I wish this game would switch to 3v3 with one round like WoW. I don't think its a better for worse system, but it keeps the que moving.

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That is not just related to ranked. It’s in all forums of pvp because Bioware just want numbers in the queue and not quality pvp.

People don’t care if they win or lose as long as they get what ever reward they are there for.

 

The only solution is for rewards to only drop from wins

 

The solution is very good, but has one flaw when regs are concerned: it encourages going all-out to stack the deck for victory, which means many more voice chatting trinity premades (with tanky DPS such as mercs) and nearly zero chances for any group who happens to play against them.

 

However, this problem doesn't exist for ranked, because in ranked we already have a separate queue (and, off topic, miraculously it didn't kill either queue entirely. Just dropping this here), so there aren't a lot of methods to stack the deck...

So if we take your solution to ranked only, we get: change the daily/weekly mission (only they give the mats, right?) to progress only for victories rather than progress for every match with victories counting twice.

 

What a surprise, this is how things used to be before they got "improved" :D

 

In the devs' defense, I gotta say it made sense on the paper. "If losing only cuts your daily/weekly progression by half rather than entirely, people will be less toxic about losing". In truth, irrelevant because toxicity is mostly about the loss of ELO (Lundorff's solution might help there. A very good idea which should also be implemented regardless, but it alone doesn't solve the farmer problem, only softens the consequence of it). In addition, actually increases toxicity due to "better targets" for toxicity (farmers) and also that now even the actual bads who try to win can be over-hated because they can be considered farmers by mistake.

Devs, we understand your mistake. You can safely revert. It won't make anyone look stupid.

Edited by Rafiknoll
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That is actually a great idea. No need to punish people scores when so many factors are out of their control.

 

+1 for a win

 

The problem I see here is the play time. This way ranked would become a grind like gear or cxp in the game. If you want to win just keep playing. Some people have more time, some have less. If you sort the ranked leaderboards by Wins you will get some known players, there are those who played 1000 games but have a rating of 1300.

 

These people would be top now, but are they really top? Cause they play all day and everyday? That would be the problem with +1 for a win.

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Now in days, there are so many of them there is no way to predict it. Trust me, I've tried. It's a 50-50 chance. If you don't get them one round, you sure as hell will get them the next round.

 

Its like I said before solo ranked has become a lottery and what angers me is that it limits the time you can seriously play it. Like the worst time is to play after reset on Tuesday where most of "these players" que. Then you have the time from 5 pm to like 9 pm where you are at risk of getting them into your team. So basically it totally limits your play time and fun in the game. Its actually not fair cause these people do what they want in the game and get their reward, but you cannot, they block you from doing what you like.

 

I'm fine with the kid that gets globalled 5 times in a row but eventually learns.

 

There are not there to learn. The worst thing is that in some matches we are able to carry them. That is even worse cause they get the idea that its possible for them to get wins too.... but they don't improve they just hope on getting a good team and so that another farmer is on other team.

 

 

I honestly have no idea how to solve this issue. Low population, and matts have created a problem, but there is no definitive answer. On one hand, I enjoy earning matts in solo ranked and it also incentives a lot more people to play alts in ranked and keep the que alive rather then go play regs with friends. I don't think taking matts out of solo ranked is the solution.

 

Ultimately the only option left is to vote kick and "kindly ask" players to stop queing. Make it the least enjoyable process of farming matts/gear for the people that are making ranked the least enjoyable for everyone else.

 

Yesterday I played ranked for about 6 hours and have encountered several "such players" and we have been vote kicking this one jug, but he kept on quing all these hours. Besides him there were 2 assasins, 1 guardian (he even was swaping tank and dps spec) and 1 scoundrel who kept quing till 1 am! So yeah, I would say the situation is quite bad.

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The problem I see here is the play time. This way ranked would become a grind like gear or cxp in the game. If you want to win just keep playing. Some people have more time, some have less. If you sort the ranked leaderboards by Wins you will get some known players, there are those who played 1000 games but have a rating of 1300.

 

These people would be top now, but are they really top? Cause they play all day and everyday? That would be the problem with +1 for a win.

 

In an optimal scenario you are of course 100% correct. ELO would work much, much better if ranked had the population of WoW or Fortnite but alas that is not the case. That is why I am leaning towards a "only count wins and ignore losses"-concept. Yes it would mean that Mr. NoLifer with 5000 matches and only 20% wins would still be one of "the best" for that season. So be it. It is the only compromise I can think of that is also realistic for BW to technically implement.

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In an optimal scenario you are of course 100% correct. ELO would work much, much better if ranked had the population of WoW or Fortnite but alas that is not the case. That is why I am leaning towards a "only count wins and ignore losses"-concept. Yes it would mean that Mr. NoLifer with 5000 matches and only 20% wins would still be one of "the best" for that season. So be it. It is the only compromise I can think of that is also realistic for BW to technically implement.

 

I don't care personally, as it is my opinion ranked is little more than a pissing match between people who want to think they're better than everyone else, but you could use a win system and attempt to normalize it by matches played, setting a minimum number of games before its counted. Thus, attempting to take the best of both systems.

 

Hardly perfect and still a buttload of problems, but it would screw your Mr Nolifer if he cant manage more than 1 win every 5 matches. (I.e. just because he has 1000 wins he wouldn't automatically be ahead of someone with 100 wins (unless of course the 100 wins had played 500 matches, thus making them equal)). Such normalizations are a mainstay of most comparisons. I.e. GDP per capita (because larger country implies greater GDP, so comparing directly is meaningless - see the US ($19.39 trillion GDP) vs say Qatar ($167.6 billion) then compare GDP per capita (US = $59531.66, Qatar = $63505.81)

Edited by KendraP
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In the current system, skill doesn't matter because random factors such as farmers can drop a good player below what he deserves, and there are wintraders.

In the win counter system, skill doesn't matter because the number of matches can compensate, and there are win traders.

So anyhow, skill doesn't matter, and there are wintraders. Might as well exchange the current system to one that doesn't punish lack of luck but instead rewards efforts more than results (this is how schools these days do anyway :rolleyes:)

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The solo ranked rating system redesign wasn't exactly optimal but it still works a lot better than a point system based on wins... that sounds rather horrendous.

 

If they discourage/limit mat farmers and put more restrictions on who can queue (expertise stat worked decent IMO), all the changes they made have the potential to work well in solos. (Also remove cross-role backfilling)

 

Optimally you want everyone in the queue to be able to "carry themselves", making the most skill on a team the deciding factor for wins in most cases (As has been the case roughly in the first 7-8 seasons in solos)

 

In past couple seasons (with the addition of mats) the deciding factor is mostly the lack of skill, as it is hard for example, for even a team with 3 skilled players to carry 1 player that instantly dies vs an average skilled team (its effectively often a 3v4 or 2v4 in the current queue climate)

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While ever crafting is part of pvp gear progression, they will keep putting mats into ranked pvp so that pvpers have a way to gear up as fast as ops guys.

 

The best solution is to go back to the old pvp gearing system for pvpers and get rid of gear crafting for pvp. Then they can remove mats from ranked and be done with it,

 

Reintroduce proper gating to enter ranked and then offer some great rewards (not mats) for doing well in ratings or winning only.

 

If you have a legacy Valor rating and not a character Valor rating, you could set a Valor gate of 70-90 and a gear gate (with pvp gear).

That way people should have some clue as to pvping before they even step into ranked.

Edited by Totemdancer
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People still in denial about the state of solo ranked... and the community has themselves to thank for the lack of interest and low population in que.

 

Yes.. there isn't any valid reason for people to que ranked and in order to get the pops going, Bioware had to introduce mats to give us a reason to que.

 

Also... there are a lot of angry kids in ranked who just can't stop talking trash if things don't go as they hoped. If you look at how many people PVP In total in regs and what % of them que ranked too, you will find a major discrepancy... If half of the people who do regs would que ranked we would have a lot of pops.

 

BUT... since season 8 the population in solo has shrinked a lot. In s8 it was popping almost all day on Red Eclipse than in S9 there were less people queing and now in S10 on DM it starts to pop in prime time mostly.

 

Fix ? There is no fix. Period. Accept it as it is or don't que. Also, OP you are a hypocrite.. You cry about the state of solo ranked and yet you are very hostile to the newbies who que. ;) You totally deserve what you get from the que.

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